Rochester MN MTG
 
HomeHome  CalendarCalendar  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  UsergroupsUsergroups  RegisterRegister  Log in  
Similar topics
Latest topics
» Possible Gatecrash Spoilers (Also, this place is boring. What's going on down in Rochester to kill the forums?)
Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:30 am by Ran

» Return to Ravnica
Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:52 am by Ran

» trading post
Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:40 pm by Ran

» Bruna as Commander
Tue Jun 19, 2012 11:21 am by Blacrowe

» Sacrifice!
Tue May 22, 2012 11:01 pm by MindofMyrddin

» U/R Mad Cards (Avacyn Restored)
Sun May 13, 2012 9:00 pm by MindofMyrddin

» G/W Aggro GP Minneapolis
Thu May 10, 2012 2:59 pm by MindofMyrddin

» WTF is wizards doing to me.
Fri May 04, 2012 5:08 pm by Ran

» U/W Delver Spirit Mantle
Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:48 pm by gunndaddyp

October 2017
MonTueWedThuFriSatSun
      1
2345678
9101112131415
16171819202122
23242526272829
3031     
CalendarCalendar

Share | 
 

 no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
workshoptelescope

avatar

Posts : 664
Join date : 2009-11-23
Location : Rochester, MN

PostSubject: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:54 am

so, m11's titans are apparently good. even the bad ones are better than my cards because none of my cards are titans. with nationals coming up, and i am assuming from the poll that at least 4 of you are going to grind, the standard metagame is in need of analysis (and, ideally, being broken). now, grinders are apparently different than most tournament experiences, as you're really not necessarily beholden to the metagame at large to decide what to play. you can go rogue. dan will go rogue. madsen will probably go rogue. but here's the thing: the whole world might go rogue. which means the metagame matters. why does the metagame matter? because "going rogue" as a method of strategic deck selection is beholden to the metagame. what is considered "rogue" exists only in relation to what is normative. so, then, just what in the hell is the new, post-m11 normal? well, the dust certainly hasn't settled yet but the hivemind is working it out. jason posted this quick rundown (thanks jason) over here http://rmtg.logu2.com/standard-f11/top-decks-in-july-t409.htm#2191

now, because this list is missing stuff (nothing personal, jason), i want to take a closer look at what decks are working consistently enough to be considered "lasting" decks in the metagame. since the release of m11, there have been a number of nationals tournaments and ptqs. here's a compiled list of deck lists: http://rmtg.logu2.com/standard-f11/aggregating-standard-t411.htm#2193

so, what's working? well, as i said at the beginning, titans are. before m11, turboland was the only ramp deck on the block and it was putting up serious numbers. however, in the wake of primeval titan, turboland has mutated or been outright replaced. titan force, titan ramp, and turbo titan have all kind of taken the place that turboland occupied. the three aforementioned decks are largely the same strategy with a few modifications. they all use primeval titan and mana ramp to enable either destructive force lock down, excessive valakut triggers (i'm glaring at you, clint), or updating the turboland shell. sample lists:
Titan ForceTitan RampTurbo Titan
Maindeck:

Creatures
2 Frost Titan
2 Primeval Titan

Instants
2 Into the Roil
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Mana Leak

Planeswalkers
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
4 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Sorceries
3 Cultivate
3 Destructive Force
3 Explore
2 Mind Spring
3 Rampant Growth

Basic Lands
4 Forest
4 Island
3 Mountain

Lands
2 Halimar Depths
2 Khalni Garden
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Raging Ravine
2 Scalding Tarn

Sideboard:
1 Mold Shambler
3 Obstinate Baloth
2 Pelakka Wurm
2 Mind Control
4 Negate
1 Destructive Force
2 Earthquake
Maindeck:

Creatures
3 Avenger of Zendikar
4 Primeval Titan
4 Siege-Gang Commander

Enchantments
4 Khalni Heart Expedition

Instants
1 Comet Storm
4 Harrow

Sorceries
4 Cultivate
4 Explore
4 Rampant Growth

Basic Lands
6 Forest
12 Mountain

Lands
3 Evolving Wilds
3 Terramorphic Expanse
4 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle

Sideboard:
1 Elixir of Immortality
2 Acidic Slime
4 Obstinate Baloth
1 Pelakka Wurm
2 Back to Nature
1 Earthquake
4 Forked Bolt
Maindeck:

Creatures
1 Avenger of Zendikar
4 Lotus Cobra
4 Oracle of Mul Daya
4 Primeval Titan

Legendary Creatures
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre

Planeswalkers
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Sorceries
3 Cultivate
3 Explore
4 Rampant Growth
3 Time Warp

Basic Lands
7 Forest
5 Island

Lands
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Halimar Depths
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Mystifying Maze
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Verdant Catacombs

Legendary Lands
1 Eye of Ugin

Sideboard:
4 Obstinate Baloth
2 Pelakka Wurm
3 Roil Elemental
2 Negate
4 Summoning Trap

now, i don't know a damned thing about playing these decks. they seem pretty self-evident. however, what is optimal... i have no idea. i've talked to clint about titan ramp a bit and i've learned that you really do have to pick one or the other with approaches. you are either a destructive force deck or a valakut ramp deck. i harbor ill will toward "turboland", so my opinion of turbo titan list is essentially bile and spite, even if it works. i think that the inclusion of blue in the titan force list is probably better than leaving it out.

now, what are you supposed to do to beat such a deck? it appears to really depend on the build. turbo titan doesn't do all that well with manabarbs. none of them like counterspells. however, all of these lists are really flexible in that they all have multiple angles of attack and primeval titan isn't their only way of winning. however, a resolved titan often wins the game outright. so, ideas on combating or killing this?

in part 2, the return of it being cool to play blue...
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Knepps

avatar

Posts : 263
Join date : 2010-04-10

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Wed Aug 04, 2010 2:43 pm

The Destructive force one hurts because it has mana leak backup, while valakut is just uncounterable. The mana denial in standard isn't ideal really, Tectonic Edge? Demolish? Goblin Ruinblaster?

What about spread em? making valakuts islands or just destroying them seems to be good? But they have so much ramp that land denial seems like no good.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Blacrowe

avatar

Posts : 275
Join date : 2010-01-09
Location : Rochester

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Thu Aug 05, 2010 4:27 pm

turbo titan is the strongest here, and Jund spot removal (term for titan, pulse for Jace) coupled with tectonic edge may have to suffice (ugh) until the scars shennanigans on 10/1. And I will not spend the money to mirror. WILL. NOT!
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.facebook.com/blacrowe
Blacrowe

avatar

Posts : 275
Join date : 2010-01-09
Location : Rochester

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Thu Aug 05, 2010 9:01 pm

...as to a Jace 2.0-free mono blue you may be alluding to, the viability of...?:

4x Preordain
4x Mana Leak
4x Sphinx of JI
4x Conundrum Sphinx
4x Sea Gate Oracle
4x Coralhelm Commander
4x Halimar Depths
4x Aether Adept
4x Spreading Seas
2x Negate
2x Cancel
16x Island
4x Tectonic Edge

BOARD: Jace B, Scroll Thief, Soaring Seacliff, Flashfreeze, Sword of Vengeance, Basilisk Collar, Kraken's Eye...no idea
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.facebook.com/blacrowe
JakeFaas
Admin
avatar

Posts : 944
Join date : 2009-10-24
Age : 33
Location : Rochester, MN

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Thu Aug 05, 2010 9:32 pm

Jason: I think something like skill borrower actually makes conundrum sphinx much better. I'd almost rather play it over oracle
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Blacrowe

avatar

Posts : 275
Join date : 2010-01-09
Location : Rochester

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Thu Aug 05, 2010 10:42 pm

SB's a great choice, and I had the sinking feeling this needed more "interactivity" that she lends-- this is nice flavor, at least until it phases. Though it's a legit reprint chance if Scars goes esper
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.facebook.com/blacrowe
Blacrowe

avatar

Posts : 275
Join date : 2010-01-09
Location : Rochester

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Fri Aug 06, 2010 10:34 am

Not so fast. Italy Nationals: No titan in top 5--

[1]


Mythic Conscription 1st place Federico Ronchi Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Naya Shaman 2nd place Daniel Spanò Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Jund 3rd place Guido Roccoli Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Polymorph 4th place Enrico Torazza Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
U/W Control 5th place Paolo Testa Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Titan Ramp 6th place Andrea Giarola Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Titan Ramp 7th place Angelo Asta Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Titan Ramp 8th place Stefano Biasio Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.facebook.com/blacrowe
workshoptelescope

avatar

Posts : 664
Join date : 2009-11-23
Location : Rochester, MN

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Fri Aug 06, 2010 10:55 am

Jason wrote:
Not so fast. Italy Nationals: No titan in top 5--

[1]


Mythic Conscription 1st place Federico Ronchi Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Naya Shaman 2nd place Daniel Spanò Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Jund 3rd place Guido Roccoli Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Polymorph 4th place Enrico Torazza Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
U/W Control 5th place Paolo Testa Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Titan Ramp 6th place Andrea Giarola Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Titan Ramp 7th place Angelo Asta Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy
Titan Ramp 8th place Stefano Biasio Nationals 2010-08-01 Rimini, Italy

lol... but out of a tournament of how many people, three in top 8?!?!

that, when combined with the rest of the nationals and ptqs, is an unruly number of top 8 finishes (here lumping all titan decks under the same umbrella).
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Blacrowe

avatar

Posts : 275
Join date : 2010-01-09
Location : Rochester

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Fri Aug 06, 2010 4:06 pm

yes, yes--as you saw I lumped all PTitan decks together in the 'July' post. I mean, what other card makes Jace2 look like a secondary theme?! LMFAO
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.facebook.com/blacrowe
JakeFaas
Admin
avatar

Posts : 944
Join date : 2009-10-24
Age : 33
Location : Rochester, MN

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Sat Aug 07, 2010 9:30 am

Jason wrote:
yes, yes--as you saw I lumped all PTitan decks together in the 'July' post. I mean, what other card makes Jace2 look like a secondary theme?! LMFAO

Wow, can't argue with that logic! that makes a lot of sense!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
magic jesus

avatar

Posts : 277
Join date : 2010-08-22
Age : 36

PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    Sun Aug 22, 2010 2:18 pm

A few things im taking away from my time at nationals, and having chatted with some guys who get paid rediculous money to get drunk in bars and play magic during the day. Standard is going to be dominated by combo-ish decks especialy once shards block rolls out, we currently have ascension, runeflare trap, and this new dregevine is pretty combo-y. Also, Green titan = good, black titan = mediocre, red titan = really good (ask dan about Chapins bomb play), blue titan = insane, white titan = sucks.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1    

Back to top Go down
 
no titans? your deck probably sucks, pt.1
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» U15 Boys Ottawa Titans AAU Basketball Team
» Titans Transactions
» Dota 2 sucks!
» Puush sucks
» Which starter deck?

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
RMTG :: Standard-
Jump to: