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 To Infinity...And Beyond!

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Posts : 58
Join date : 2012-02-07
Age : 24
Location : Roch-Town

PostSubject: To Infinity...And Beyond!   Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:20 pm

Hey! So for those of you that have been at events with me recently, you might have seen it. I am building a Zombie-Combo (Zombo) deck. Here's how it works:

Gravecrawler is sacrificed with Grimgrin, Corpse Born and then cast again for free, due to Rooftop Storm. This activates Burning Vengeance an infinite amount of times, because I can just keep sacrificing the Gravecrawler over and over again.

In games with this deck, I have been having problems getting all the pieces out. Right now, I am utilizing Faithless Looting, Forbidden Alchemy, and Desperate Ravings in a 3-2-2 ratio, and sometimes a Rooftop Storm that I could have used ends up in the graveyard... I am also looking into adding Liliana of the Veil somewhere to make it harder for my opponent to do anything, but that would also mean I need to draw more cards!

The current list is as follows. Advice is appreciated, especially in the sideboard.

4x Gravecrawler
4x Burning Vengeance
4x Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
3x Rooftop Storm

2x Gitaxian Probe
2x Vapor Snag
2x Spellskite
3x Mana Leak
3x Dissipate
2x Black Sun's Zenith

Deck Sift:
3x Faithless Looting
2x Desperate Ravings
2x Forbidden Alchemy

1x Snapcaster Mage
2x Grim Lavamancer
2x Unburial Rites

2x Haunted Fengraf
19x Other land

1x Surgical Extraction
1x Artful Dodge
2x Vapor Snag
2x Turn Aside
4x Negate
2x Slagstorm
1x Havengul Lich
2x Corrosive Gale
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Join date : 2009-10-27
Age : 26
Location : Rochester

PostSubject: Re: To Infinity...And Beyond!   Fri Mar 16, 2012 2:10 am

Alright, sounds like you have a really cool deck going here. This is the first time i've seen a Rooftop Storm combo deck, especially an infinite one, so props on that. This is just what I was thinking while looking at your deck, so feel free to judge my critiques as you please.

First, I feel like you're not really appreciating the value of Forbidden Alchemy as much as you should. It digs you four cards deep, and when combo-ing, that's relevant. I like it much more than the Desperate Ravings or Faithless Looting for what you're trying to do. Ponder has made the lives of many a combo player much easier as well. Setting up your turns will help you get all of the pieces you need to go infinite.

Secondly, I'm not sure how I feel about the Grim Lavamncers. I really only like to see them in a mono-red burn deck, I feel like you could use those slots more effectively, either for more removal or more Snapcasters. Snapcaster's will help you reuse digging tools like Ponders (please play Ponder Smile ) and will also give you more value from your removal suite and counters. Saving a milled Black Sun with a Snapcaster, always good. I would really like to see you find better cards than Gitaxian Probe and Vapor Snag as well. You're in black, so why snag something that you can Go for the Throat?

Which brings me to my third point: Removal. Vapor snag will save you for a turn, but that's not always enough. I think that Go for the Throat is an extremely relevant card right now with how many zombies are around, and Tragic Slip has really never been a sight for sore eyes in games I've played. If you're worried about tokens, Ratchet Bomb is the best answer for them that we have right now. Unless you want to play Curse of Death's hold, but that might be a little greedy for your deck.

Cards I think could go in: Go for the Throat, Tragic Slip, Ponder, more Forbidden Alchemy and Snapcaster Mages.

Cards I think you don't need: Grim Lavamancer, Desperate Ravings, Gixatian Probe, Vapor Snag.

I hope that you found my comments useful. I think that you have a really cool deck in the making, and it seems like a lot of fun to play. I wish you the best of luck with it. Smile

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PostSubject: Re: To Infinity...And Beyond!   Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:08 am

Another thing Snapcaster Mage will do for you, it gives you another way to get some damage with your Burning Vengeance in lieu of your infinite combo. From everything I've seen, the best combo decks around have the ability to win without finding their combo, just in case things go awry. It also lets you snap back removal spells and Ponder... and having the surprise blocker has saved many a control player from certain doom. And yeah, Tragic Slip seems good, since your combo relies on Gravecrawler shenanigans, with luck your dudes should die enough to make it relevant a lot. And it wastes Delver or Champion of the Parish in their tracks, before they can cause you any serious grief.

I love Lavamancer and all that he does but... Kurt may be right. I don't think it's because you're not in mono red though... I think it's because it seems like it fights with the combo you're trying to get to work, since it eats cards out of your graveyard that you could flash back. However, I could see how he'd still be valuable, since there will be a lot of cards going to your yard that aren't able to be flashed... and Grim Lavamancer is crazy good. You can do so much damage with a shock that you get to play every turn!
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PostSubject: Re: To Infinity...And Beyond!   Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:20 am

I agree with Kurt for the most part. A few notes:

I like geistflame. kills agro dorks and with BV in play it can do 6dmg amongst 4 targets for 5 mana in a turn.

I like 4x mana leak, 2x disspiate in your deck. Turn 3 you wanna be dropping BV or Alchemy to get it. Your turn 2 is better served on defense. Turn 2 defense spells: GoForThroat, Leak, Whipflare maybe?

Ravings is bad in combo. You're looking for specific pieces, and random can hose you. Looting and Forbidden are great sift cards for combo pieces. I'd run 4 of each. Think Twice is a 3rd option if you want some extra draw. I prolly wouldn't run it, but it goes with BV.

Spellskite is better in SB. I assume it's in here to protect Rooftop. Very few ppl roll MD enchant hate. You have unburial rites to get back any critter that dies.

Lavamancer is redundant. BV throws around 2 dmg all day.

Lastly... you could veer down a Mill avenue by adding Undead Alchemist + Dream Twist. Fits zombie nonsense and BV. Doesn't seem horrible Wink

Possible deck:

1s: Geistflame, dream twist, faithless, G crawler

2s: Whip, Leak, GftT, think twice

3s: Forbidden, BV, dissipate

4s: Undead Alchemist, Snap (he's basically a 4 drop)

5s: Grimgrin, Rites

>5s: BS Zenith, RT Storm

bunch of lands + Nephalia Drownyard

I hope this helps in some way Wink

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Posts : 58
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Age : 24
Location : Roch-Town

PostSubject: Re: To Infinity...And Beyond!   Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:16 pm

Thank you guys for all of your help!

So, I thought I'd simplify the heck out of this deck. I took out the red entirely. Still infinite, though~ I decided that I had to have a more dependable backup plan than just "ping with Geistflame" because at the moment, most decks don't give me time to recover. Again, any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Also, I do need a playset of Gut Shots for the sideboard. If it works for Delver, right? And a playset of Drowned Catacomb. So if you have any of either, and are willing to trade them, I'd appreciate it if you let me know what you needed, and maybe I could hook you up Smile

ZOMBO (now with extra Zombies!)
4x Gravecrawler
4x Diregraf Captain
3x Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
3x Rooftop Storm

Other Creatures
1x Snapcaster Mage
2x Undead Alchemist
2x Havengul Lich

3x Ponder
2x Black Sun's Zenith

2x Noxious Revival
2x Tragic Slip
3x Dream Twist
3x Mana Leak
2x Go for the Throat
2x Forbidden Alchemy
2x Dissipate

4x Nephalia Drownyard
8x Swamp
9x Island
2x Curse of Death's Hold
1x Cryptoplasm
3x Turn Aside
2x Vapor Snag
1x Surgical Extraction
2x Spellskite
2x Evil Twin
2x Corrosive Gale

Like I said, I would like to throw in some Gut Shotty action. If four seems wrong, I'd appreciate it if you have other ideas~
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